Slower gameplay than the SNES version?

Talk about the Donkey Kong Country 3 port for GBA.

Slower gameplay than the SNES version?

Postby Kiddy14 » March 14th, 2008, 2:38 pm

This is a merged topic, combining the previously separate topics "SLower Kongs?" and "Speed Failure".

Has anybody noticed the the Dixie and Kiddy from the GBA version are a lot slower than the ones in the SNES, but not just that, they're even slower than Dixie and Diddy in DKC2 or Diddy and Donkey in DKC both from the GBA versions. Is kinda weird because the characters seem to interact the same way Diddy and Dixie do in DKC2, you can't say the same for DKC since the engine is kinda different, just slightly, but is...

Anybody has noticed that also?
Last edited by Qyzbud on September 4th, 2008, 1:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Merged in similar discussion and renamed this topic
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Re: SLower Kongs?

Postby Kowbrainz » March 14th, 2008, 6:55 pm

I noticed this back when I got the game - it's especially noticeable in Riverside Race, as I can only get 1:02. Swimming is much slower than on the SNES, so the route of the level involves keeping out of the water whenever you can. Rolling through enemies also does not give your character a speed boost, and Kiddy's water skip is a lot slower.

I don't know if they did it to take the difficulty of the game down or what... but it really frustrates me when going through the toboggan levels and only being able to chug along at 5mph...
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Re: SLower Kongs?

Postby Kiddy14 » March 15th, 2008, 2:29 pm

Yeah, it's kinda sad, but I've noticed something...

In some levels where there is a gap (Google translation, don't trust it too much), and there's inmediatly an enemy, you roll through it and you make a speed-boost, this is easy in Doorstop Dash where there are the 4 mice...
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Re: SLower Kongs?

Postby Cody » April 9th, 2008, 7:49 pm

Kowbrainz wrote:....when going through the toboggan levels and only being able to chug along at 5mph...

The drainpipe levels are ridiculously slow compared to the SNES version because they're literally twice as slow, though Tearaway Toboggan is pretty fast.

On further note, the game's graphics are well-polished. I can safely say that Barrel Drop Bounce looks better than its Super NES counterpart.
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Speed Failure

Postby Kowbrainz » August 24th, 2008, 4:36 pm

Just picked this game up the other day since I wanted something to play during a long car trip. And I know not to again.

For anyone who picks up this port, it becomes quite apparent when you start playing that the game is considerably slower than the games on the SNES. Running is extremely slow. Painfully slow, I mean; search some DKC3 GBA vids on youtube if you like. Rolling through enemies does not achieve a speed boost. Entering water slows you down further. Waterskipping with Kiddy also slows you down. Tobboggan levels are slowed down a lot to make them easier for younger players.

I already knew all this, but I wanted to play anyway. I wanted to see what time I could achieve for an any% run of the game (beating the first K.Rool). So I started off, seeing how fast I could get into the`warp barrels for the first few levels. Easy enough.

The real trouble presented itself when I reached Mekanos and Fireball Frenzy. In the SNES version of the game, it is possible to run through levels in their entirety without stopping or slowing down if you have the right jumping reflexes. In the GBA version - no chance. You NEED to stop before certain enemies or you will die, no exceptions. This was the main change that really frustrated me for this port, so much so that I don't think I'll touch it again for a very long time. I've read somewhere in the past that the original DKC games were designed specifically so that players could speed through the levels without objects getting in their way, so it baffles me that the GBA team would change things here. The DKC trilogy never struck me as one which was too hard for new players, so I don't know why they would make it easier for new players whilst making it harder for veterans to enjoy. :/

I haven't played the other ports for the GBA, but from what I recall nothing like this was done to them. Don't know why the third game had to be any different.
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Re: Speed Failure

Postby gamer_boy997 » August 25th, 2008, 5:53 am

Kowbrainz wrote:Rolling through enemies does not achieve a speed boost.


Correct and INcorrect. Yes, you don't achieve a speed boost for rolling through 1 enemy, but if you roll through 2 or more in one roll, you WILL achieve a speed boost.
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Re: Speed Failure

Postby Kiddy14 » August 25th, 2008, 10:24 am

Actually, no...

Speed-boosts in this game can be achieved by either:

1.- Rolling through an enemy in an unstable floor (eg: Dingy Drain-pipe, Doorstop Dash)
2.- Jumping and at the exact frame when you touch the floor roll (every level). Probably a variant of #1.
3.- Rolling through a pit and when falling touching an enemy (eg: Lakeside Limbo, Skidda's Row); another variant of #1.
4.- Where Rare wanted it to happen (Stormy Seas).
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Re: Speed Failure

Postby Kowbrainz » August 25th, 2008, 4:27 pm

Lol, Stormy Seas doesn't count. >.>

I forgot about the unstable floor one, and I do remember speeding up when rolling through the Bristles in Dingy Drainpipe if I recall correctly, but that isn't my point. Even if there are occasional speed boosts in certain levels, the game is not designed for players to be able to go through an entire level quickly. While you may speed up in some areas, you'll usually slow right down soon afterwards; sometimes even to a complete stop. That isn't fun; it's just poor design.
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Re: Speed Failure

Postby Rodent » August 26th, 2008, 5:49 pm

I noticed that there was no boost and they ran slow, but I still enjoyed the port for the most part. The music wasn't as good as the last two, but eh.
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Re: Speed Failure

Postby Kowbrainz » August 26th, 2008, 9:08 pm

Eh, I've decided I'll do a segmented any% run for it anyway. Just because I need something I can play over and over on a handheld and New SMB is getting a little old in my opinion.

I'll post back with my best times after I've finished the run,then we can see how they compare to a console run of the game perhaps. I'm still annoyed at how slow the game can get at some points, but meh...

The music for the port is actually quite good, but the problem lies in it not being adapted to the levels very well. Many songs take a long time to get to the main beat of the tune, and since the track will restart from the beginning after you die or exit a bonus barrel, you'll rarely be able to hear the full tracks in all their glory unless you sit the game down on pause for a while.

I also think David Wise may have simply been given a list of types of music to compose, like a 'snow' theme or a 'jetty' theme, rather than being able to view each of the levels his music was going to be used for while composing. Key example of this is the tree theme. It's a nice tune, but just doesn't work for levels like Sunken Spruce (sp?) and Ripsaw Rage. :|
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Re: Speed Failure

Postby Qyzbud » August 26th, 2008, 9:52 pm

I'm with ya, Kowz. If you can't zip through levels smoothly, there's not that much fun to be had. I wonder why Rare 'fixed' so many things that quite simply weren't broken to begin with. DKC3 had its shortcomings already, but they've certainly added to the list with the GBA release. :|
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Re: Speed Failure

Postby Tiptup Jr. » August 28th, 2008, 8:08 am

Wha-...

I don't have any problems with the DKC3 port. Like, I haven't played either version in a while, but I don't remember anything bad about it. I really enjoyed it.
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Re: Speed Failure

Postby Swing King » August 30th, 2008, 9:00 am

Not to be rude or anything Kowz, but are you intent on bashing this game? Reading some of the other threads on this subforum, you seem to hate Pacifica, Krocktopus,( My fav Boss!) and the way it plays. I love this game, possibly more than the original. ( And thats saying something). But you were right about one thing, the music. Possibly better than the original. You have an opinion though. And I respect that.
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Re: Slower gameplay than the SNES version?

Postby Qyzbud » September 4th, 2008, 1:33 pm

Perhaps I'm just a devout SNES fan biased against the ports, but I think Kowz is pretty accurate with his comments. The gameplay of the DKC3 GBA port is definitely lacking in momentum when compared with the original SNES version. Some can happily overlook other issues ('silly' sound effects, lack of Swanky's target-toss game, OMG KROCTOPUS, etc...), but when the basic gameplay loses its spark due to beginner friendly (or perhaps small-screen-friendly) slow movement and other such game engine changes, it's pretty hard to enjoy the flow of play. Well, for SNES-era DKC lovers like Kowz and myself, anyhow.

Oh, and anyone who wishes to discuss aspects of the DKC3 port unrelated to gameplay speed; remember, this topic isn't the place to do so!

--
Note: I've combined the previously separate topics "SLower Kongs?" and "Speed Failure". I only just realised that these were essentially 'duplicate topics'.
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Re: Slower gameplay than the SNES version?

Postby Kiddy14 » September 4th, 2008, 3:13 pm

Qyzbud wrote:[...]slow movement and other such game engine changes[...]

Now that you say that, Dixie's helicopter spin is slower than her running; which should be viceversa, helicopter-spinning should give her a little boost, not slow her down.
Spoiler!
Qyzbud wrote:Note: I've combined the previously separate topics "SLower Kongs?" and "Speed Failure". I only just realised that these were essentially 'duplicate topics'.

You really had to write the topic's name, without correcting my typo? :cry: Nah, just teasing again, I didn't notice it but 1 month ago and the topic was at the time forgotten.
I was going to suggest the same thing, but forgot...

Qyz says: Heh, it's always worth fixing typos like that... I just left it 'typo-ed' for the sake of accuracy.

(and because I like teasing, too!) ;)
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Re: Speed Failure

Postby Kowbrainz » September 4th, 2008, 7:44 pm

Swing King wrote:Not to be rude or anything Kowz, but are you intent on bashing this game? Reading some of the other threads on this subforum, you seem to hate Pacifica, Krocktopus,( My fav Boss!) and the way it plays. I love this game, possibly more than the original. ( And thats saying something). But you were right about one thing, the music. Possibly better than the original. You have an opinion though. And I respect that.


There was a time during the period this game was released that I played it through several times and couldn't make sense of some of the bashings of it on GameFAQs. Most of it was due to the blind gamers getting nostalgia in the way of their perception of the game, so the main thing you'd hear from them was 'why didn't they keep the old music?'. This was a silly accusation, though, since I very much doubt that the game would have sounded any better with the SNES music. I believe Jamie Hughs was in charge of porting the SNES tunes to the GBA titles, DKC1 and DKC2, and now whenever I listen to the music for those games on youtube I just cringe at how badly the music has been butchered; both because of the inferior hardware and the different music artist.

During the time I was playing this game, my SNES game had ceased to work, and I had to get another one later that year (this was in early 2006). During the later part of 2006, I finally bought another copy of the game and started speedrunning (or attempting to, lol) the levels in DKC2 and DKC3, because there wasn't much left for me after beating the games normally several times; I just wanted to do it better and faster. I soon realised that the GBA game had been dumbed down considerably. I don't mind Pacifica to be honest, as it contained a few neat new ideas that the original didn't. Kroctopus just didn't fit in the game or series, and while I believe Kerozene was a crappy inclusion in the DKC2 port, at least he fitted in with the rest of the game. Anyway, all that aside, I just don't like the way that this game doesn't really allow you to get much better on subsequent play throughs of the game, as you're always restricted by this crawling speed. I don't hate the game, per se, I mean it's definitely playable and I'd still give it something between a 7 and an 8 if reviewed; but when you hold it up against the original there are just too many things that don't hold up.
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Re: Slower gameplay than the SNES version?

Postby aperson98 » March 26th, 2010, 2:23 pm

Sorry to bump yet another old topic but I feel you only discussed what was slower about the GBA version and really didn't give it a fighting chance against the SNES version. Some things I found faster on GBA include,

Blast barrels do not have as much lag before firing like on SNES.

Squawks shoots nuts/eggs faster then he did on SNES.

When holding the run button while carrying a barrel/keg Dixie does not slow down to walking speed like on SNES. (This makes getting the DK coin in Demolition Drain Pipe easier.)

Kiddy's jump seems a bit less laggy compared to the SNES version.

Enguarde's stab is faster and has a bigger hitbox then on SNES.

Climbing up ropes seems a little faster then on SNES.

I cannot say I am 100 percent correct on this but I have played both versions for a while and tested this out a little.
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Re: Slower gameplay than the SNES version?

Postby The Banana Bird » January 25th, 2012, 3:15 am

Sorry about this bump, but I have found something. The Koindozers move slower in the GBA version then they do in the SNES version, making it easier for younger people.
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Re: Slower gameplay than the SNES version?

Postby reversalmushroom » May 21st, 2015, 5:48 pm

My biggest problem with the GBA port is the frame rate. The SNES version had a very fluid frame rate (was it 60 or 30fps?), but the GBA version's isn't quite on the same level. It's a shame because I like a lot about the port, so much so, that I want to like it more than the original, but the frame rate is very important to me, so I can't. :(
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Re: Slower gameplay than the SNES version?

Postby Tompa » May 22nd, 2015, 2:34 am

Both games are actually running at 60 FPS. GBA version just feels generally slower because you move a lot slowwer compared to SNES.
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