Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby Jomingo » March 16th, 2008, 11:50 am

I was thinking about what characters/features I wanted in brawl, so I decided to make a topic.



I want a ton more options in the mapmaker. And Pacman, K. Rool, and Ridley should be playable.
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby BlueTronic » March 16th, 2008, 11:56 am

Jeez. Brawl just came out a week ago and you're already gathering things you want for the next? The only thing we really need in the level editor is for that stupid rotate button to actually rotate instead of flipping it sideways! :evil: You can't do crap woth that thing if you can't rotate blocks. I can't even make that awesome Swircle stage I planned! :cry:
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby Jomingo » March 16th, 2008, 12:00 pm

I'd like more backgrounds, the ability to change backgrounds, backgrounds and stage elements from different stages in the game, the ability to change the colors of stage parts, and like you said, more advanced placement options.


And Pacman.


And a Pacman stage. (that would be epic.)
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby cfh » March 16th, 2008, 1:44 pm

Pacman should not be playable. Megaman should be playable, and Pacman should be an AT.
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby BlueTronic » March 16th, 2008, 2:57 pm

I don't know what AT is, but whatever it is, Pac-Man should definitely be a playable character over Megadoofus. Pac-Man could get a power pellet and turn everyone blue and white and eat them (As a final smash, of course). I'd give my left arm for something like that. Well, not literally, but maybe a lung or perhaps a finger or two.
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby Simion32 » March 16th, 2008, 3:05 pm

The absolute worst things in the stage builder that could be improved:

1. NO PARTS LIMIT!!! I hate how you can only place so many pieces, and you make a stage but run out of room, thus ruining the idea you had. This has already happened to me 5 or so times. I don't even care about sending the levels online using my Wii - you can just use an SD card to save your levels if they are too big. Do the levels really take up that much space?! :evil:
2. Rotation option
3. Allow pieces to overlap - there are some legitimate reasons for being able to overlap parts, like having a moving platform right above spikes. I don't know why the falling blocks take up so much physical space...
4. A lot more pieces, specifically scalable thin walls/floors , that would be useful....
5. More backgrounds
6. A lot of other things
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby BlueTronic » March 16th, 2008, 3:09 pm

At least you can actually work without those. You can't make anything good without a rotate button that actually rotates!! I hope Nintendo gets so many complaints that they have to revise it just to add that feature.
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby Kowbrainz » March 16th, 2008, 4:46 pm

Megaman sounds a lot better than Pacman in my opinion... mainly because the series started out as an all out clash between Nintendo's main characters; but slowly over time second party characters were added, finally resulting in the inclusion of third party characters Sonic and Snake; which really doesn't fit, especially Snake in my opinion. Sonic I can deal with, but Snake just doesn't feel right.

Don't get me wrong; I think the whole concept of Snake's character and moves in SSBB is rather cool, it's just it was his inclusion which made the series lean towards a MUGEN-type fighter instead of just an all out brawl between Nintendo's characters.

I think 50 characters would be a good limit. I like how Sakurai has gone in developing the game; adding brand new features and branching the franchise out into unexpored territories (such as giving a proper story mode), however the number of characters and stages could certainly be a little higher. I'm not saying it should be as big as some of the fan made lists, but I feel that each game's universe should be represented by at least two characters (except of course for characters like Ice Climbers, Pit and Game & Watch).

Other than that, the only other thing I'd really like is faster gameplay like SSBM; even though that was mainly because of glitches found in the game; SSBB just feels a lot slower and programmed to be centred more around aerial fights.
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby cfh » March 17th, 2008, 1:02 am

Simion32 wrote:1. NO PARTS LIMIT!!! I hate how you can only place so many pieces, and you make a stage but run out of room, thus ruining the idea you had. This has already happened to me 5 or so times. I don't even care about sending the levels online using my Wii - you can just use an SD card to save your levels if they are too big. Do the levels really take up that much space?! :evil:

It's there so that the game can keep a good steady frame rate. That's also why the backgrounds are just flat images.
Pac-Man should definitely be a playable character over Megadoofus. Pac-Man could get a power pellet and turn everyone blue and white and eat them (As a final smash, of course). I'd give my left arm for something like that.

That's the thing; everyone can only come up with his Final Smash. Why can't he just be an Assist Trophy that does that same thing?
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby Jomingo » March 17th, 2008, 2:58 am

Not true. Pacman is way underestimated. He has plenty of attacks and moves in his platforming games, like a rolling move, and a ground pound type move, and he also even becomes Super Pacman. If I think about it some more I could come up with an entire moveset. His stage would be a retro Pacman stage, like the mario bros./donkey Kong 75m stages. And there would be ghosts running around trying to get people, so you'd have to worry about them as well as the enemy characters.

Characters I want: 50 characters. All the same 35, plus Pacman, one more 3rd party, K. Rool, Ridley, plus 11 other new ones.
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby Banjoster » March 17th, 2008, 3:41 am

I don't think Pacman would really fit......He's just.....Oh I don't know how to say it. I just don't think he'd be very fitting for the game like Kowz said with Snake. Sonic's fine mainly from the competition Mario and Sonic had in the past. But any others like Snake, Pacman, Megaman, etc, Just don't seem to fit with the theme.:/
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby Jomingo » March 17th, 2008, 7:27 am

Yeah, but Pacman fits way better than Snake. He is a video game icon, one of the most popular characters in gaming history. He definately fits with the mario crew more than Snake does.
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby BlueTronic » March 17th, 2008, 7:43 am

...plus there'd be a ton of possibilities for moves, taunts, win/lose actions, etc. for Pac-Man.
Shooting Pac-Pellets (B), "Butt Bounce" (B+down), Rolling into characters (B+left/right), Power Pellet (Final Smash), His thumbs up w/ wink pose (Up Taunt), Jungling Pac-Pellets (Side Taunt)
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby Jomingo » March 17th, 2008, 7:45 am

Exactly, though I thought I remembered there being a Super Pacman, if so than that should be worked in there somewhere.
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby Tiptup Jr. » March 18th, 2008, 10:12 am

cfh wrote:Pacman should not be playable. Megaman should be playable, and Pacman should be an AT.


Alright, just to clear things up:

Pac-Man rules.
Megaman sucks. Onward!

It is my personal belief that every franchise should have at least two playable characters. There are some series where people can't come up with good characters for, but think about it: The Kid Icarus series could have Medusa as a second playable character. The Condor could be the Ice Climber's second character. Professor Hector could represent the Gyromite series alongside R.O.B., Sonic gets Tails, and I don't know anything about Metal Gear games. King K. Rool, Dixie, Ridley, Krystal, Pac-Man, and Blinky must also be playable in Super Smash Bros. 4. What will happen to our little LCD handheld series, you ask?

I have an interesting idea for the Game & Watch series. What if there was another selectable character besides Mr. G&W that was just a plain Game & Watch game. It would stay in the background similar to Pokemon Trainer, and you could hit Down B to switch between characters from the Game & Watch series such as Donkey Kong Jr., the guy from Tropical Fish, Mario in his Bomb's Away outfit, Stanley the Bugman, the guy from Boxing, Link, and the Bomb Squad agent from Bombsweeper. Each of these characters would move frame-by-frame like Mr. Game & Watch, but would have moves that originate from their own G&W games. As you can tell, I'm a huge Game & Watch buff, and this selectable gem would be pure fan-pleasing bliss.

Also, I require a trophy of every Nintendo character ever conceived. I can't believe they took the Stanley the Bugman and Donkey Kong Jr. trophies out of Brawl... What was that about?
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby Jomingo » March 18th, 2008, 10:50 am

Interesting ideas, but no Dixie, or Blinky. Or Tails. 3rd party characters don't deserve two characters, Blinky and Tails, and Dixie can be AT's. Not everybody deserves two characters. I think the next smash should put alot more emphasis on AT's and Smash Balls.
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby BlueTronic » March 18th, 2008, 11:11 am

What are ATs!? :x

I highly doubt it's what I had in mind:
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby Jomingo » March 18th, 2008, 11:17 am

Boy, don't you have the Google?

AT stands for Assist Trophies. It's this little glass bubble type thing, that when thrown operates similarly to a pokeball, except instead of Pokemon, different characters come out. It's a good way for characters that aren't popular enough to be playable to actually get an appearance. They come out and attack everyone except you, just like Pokemon.

Now you go learn that Google, and get back to me.
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby BlueTronic » March 18th, 2008, 11:25 am

Ironically, I actually know how to use google better than most people. :P
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby Tiptup Jr. » March 19th, 2008, 6:31 am

I just thought of a name for my second G&W character: Game & Watch Gallery! It actually fits, because... you know. ;)
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby Jomingo » March 19th, 2008, 6:33 am

Master Hand needs a bigger part in Smash 4. He was pathetic in Brawl.
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby cfh » March 19th, 2008, 8:01 am

I know, I was disappointed that you
Spoiler!
don't fight Master Hand in SSE
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby Tiptup Jr. » March 19th, 2008, 10:56 am

Spoiler!
Yeah, he just died. At least Bowser and Dedede paid their respects to the Big, Bad Hand before going to kick Tabuu's ass. :D
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby Jomingo » March 19th, 2008, 11:08 am

Spoiler!
I like how Link and Zelda revive Ganondorf, who joins them and they go off to fight Tabuu.
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby DK4Ever » July 30th, 2008, 12:36 pm

K. Rool, and Gangplank Galleon as a stage, forget Pirate Ship, Gangplank was the ORIGINAL Pirate ship :evil:

If K. rool does NOT make it into Smash 4, bad things will happen. very bad.


or at the very least, Funky. I've already thought of a moveset for him, lol.
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby Jomingo » July 31st, 2008, 1:59 am

If K. Rool's not in it, Dixie will be.

I highly doubt Funky would.
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby Tiptup Jr. » July 31st, 2008, 3:50 am

More like "if Dixie's not in, Wolf and a freaking NES peripheral will be." I can't believe Dixie was scrapped to make room for such idiotic characters. I like R.O.B., but I'd choose Dixie over half the Brawl roster any day.

And why couldn't the Ancient Minister have been Wart? He better be in Smash Bros. 4.

Spoiler!
And don't get me started on Petey Piranha... Good Lord. :roll:
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby DK4Ever » July 31st, 2008, 4:28 am

Yeah, Petey.. he should have been in, boss my <insert term for rear end here>

And the reason I say Funky, is because he was the first new Kong other than Dixie to be brought into a sports game. Why him in MK Wii instead of K. Rool? It still baffles me, as cool as Funky is, K. Rool is much more important to the series.

For a while, I assumed because Nintendo chose Funky, they preferred him.

But then I thought about it. Sakurai seems to be a big DK fan, looking at the moveset he gave Diddy, he DOESN'T dislike the DKC trilogy, although Miyamoto does (Which I still have absolutely no idea why)

So Sakurai would be putting in characters that made sense (Like how he was going to put Diddy and Dixie in as an Ice Climbers type character, but couldnt get it to work the way he wanted (And I'm actually glad for that, Diddy deserves his own character)

So yeah, your're right, either Dixie or K. Rool will make it next game (Or both, who knows)

I mean, we don't know how many characters smash 4 will have, it could have somewhere at like 60 (doubtful, but meh) so DK could have as many as 4-5 characters. Starfox doesnt need anymore, Zelda doesnt need anymore, so that leaves spots open. Pokemon is probably just going to have one replaced, so yeah.
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby Jomingo » July 31st, 2008, 4:59 am

They will add at least one character to the Mario, Zelda, and Pokemon. In fact, they might even add two. I think they'll add only one DK. I hope they add Krystal from Starfox, she's much more unique then those clones.
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby CaptainEddie » July 31st, 2008, 6:17 am

Actually, I'd like to see Tetra in the next Smash. And maybe a stage on Linebeck's ship instead of the pirate one.
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby Rodent » August 2nd, 2008, 6:41 pm

K Rool should definately be playable, or at least an AT. No Pacman or Megaman. And yeah, Gangplank Galley should be a stage so not everything Donkey Kong is about a jungle.
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby gamer_boy997 » August 3rd, 2008, 3:19 am

We probably won't get another smash bros. until 5 years or so, but if there is one, there should be King K. Rool, Dixie Kong, Kiddy Kong, Waluigi, Louie (from pikmin), and Birdo. Cranky won't be in there, because he wouldn't be seen dead in a game like smash bros. :D.
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby Jomingo » August 4th, 2008, 6:34 am

Seriously, Kiddy Kong hasn't been in a DK game in forever, why would he be in this....


And Waluigi? Birdo?
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby Tiptup Jr. » August 4th, 2008, 7:16 am

And Stanley the Bugman has to be an Assist Trophy. Mmhmm.

When I can actually get it to work, Brawl is a really fun game and the only major improvements I would make are more characters, ATs, stages, and stuff like that. I did notice, however, that in Brawl the camera controls were much more limited than they were in Melee. In Smash Bros. 4, you should be able to zoom all the way in, all the way out, and rotate all the way around. 8-)
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby gamer_boy997 » August 4th, 2008, 7:16 am

Jomingo wrote:Seriously, Kiddy Kong hasn't been in a DK game in forever, why would he be in this....


And Waluigi? Birdo?


There's always a slim chance, :D .
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby DK4Ever » August 5th, 2008, 2:25 pm

Jomingo wrote:Seriously, Kiddy Kong hasn't been in a DK game in forever, why would he be in this....


And Waluigi? Birdo?



To be fair, PIT hasnt been in a game since the early 90s... and I won't even start on the ICs...so....
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby Tiptup Jr. » August 5th, 2008, 10:35 pm

I actually liked the Ice Climbers and felt their old-schoolness added to Brawl's "All game universes are connected" thing. And they're funny (but useless) in the Subspace Emissary too. :lol:
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby Jomingo » August 6th, 2008, 12:20 am

Yeah, Pit and ICs haven't been around in a long time either, the difference is that Kid Icarus and Ice Climbers are important games of Nintendo's past. Kiddy Kong on the other hand, I'm not sure Nintendo even knows he exists...
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby Sean » September 9th, 2008, 11:52 am

Kill Assist Trophies dead. The idea of ruling out entire goddamn franchises (and that IS what they're doing, think twice before you think of requesting your favourite character as a glorified Pokémon, because they'll stay that way) goes against everything this series should be about. I weep for Custom Robo among others, frankly, it's fantastic having your main character wordlessly blacklisted and in turn ruling your series out permanently.

Otherwise... I have exactly one requirement (or rather two), and I do call it a requirement because this is the only way they will get me to buy the next Smash. The only way I was going to buy Brawl was if they included Diddy, and as anyone who's familiar with my history will know, I therefore consider "requirements" something that I do not expect to happen.

F-Zero. F-Zero F-Zero F-Zero. I could go on for hours about just how amazingly Brawl absolutely fumbled on how it treated this series, and I'd probably throw in how I feel about the series itself essentially being dead in the water and how we are all terrible people for letting that happen. But for Smash 4, I have essentially two requirements, one to be taken over the other at Sakurai's discretion. If neither of these happen, I'm not getting Smash 4 (not that it will matter since I'll probably be too busy to play games when that comes out anyway).

1. Add a second F-Zero character. Just one new one. Yes, Samurai Goroh is permanently ruled out. Oh well. There are fifty-six other characters from all six games that you can choose from, and I just want one. The fact that this is apparently so difficult to get frustrates me to no end, which is compounded by Captain Falcon returning to secret status. If he stays that way, combined with Goroh being ATed, it will basically shoot the possibility of expanding the series in Smash right between the eyes. So, if this option is not viable and I suspect it is not in Sakurai's eyes, then I move on to requirement 2...

2. Remove Captain Falcon and all traces of F-Zero from the next game.

Yes, you heard me.

I don't like Smash Falcon. At all. He was bearable in 64 and Melee, but Brawl has basically gone and ran with him to the point where he does not resemble the character he is actually supposed to be in the slightest. They've completely redesigned him, continue to muck his colour scheme up and basically refuse to make him look or act anything like he does in the actual games, to say nothing of his insipid catch phrases. Compare his Brawl design - what has now become the benchmark of the character to millions of stooges - to how he looks in F-Zero GX or even X, which Melee reproduced absolutely faithfully (bar, again, mucking up the colour scheme). They essentially redesigned him from top to bottom, added in lots of little touches and colours and changed him around entirely, which completely defeats the point of Smash Bros. as a means to represent the series it covers. (My "favourite" of the changes in the Brawl outfit is the pulling out of his scarf to flow freely. Great idea, guys, let's kill the big thing that makes him visually different from Blood Falcon. Really, that's fantastic. And then there's the random-ass kneepads...) Take this and combine it with the absolute impossibility of getting a second F-Zero character and you have a recipe for contempt.

It's not even that F-Zero didn't get a second character in Brawl. If that was it, I'd be rallying against the injustice to Yoshi. It's the fact that Brawl essentially went out of its way to say, "No, we're never adding a second character, and we're keeping this character as a put-down goofy shell of what he's supposed to be, and completely inaccurately selling this series to everyone who sees him." It was Brawl that finally broke me on Falcon's wretched calling of his attacks, and I will never forgive them for the damage that Falcon Punch has done to F-Zero. Because it's not just that it's silly: it's that people like that, because they find it hilarious, and they expect to see the same in the actual F-Zero games. And when they DON'T see it, they brush the actual games off and don't bother with them. The series is now absolutely DEAD as a result. F-Zero's the one series that Smash hurts, with false advertising that doesn't do it any favours or attracts any new fans. No one gets into F-Zero through Smash Bros. No. One.

So I'm tired of it. I'm tired of seeing Captain Walking Meme Generator touted around by people who don't know any better, and I'm tired of seeing it reflected in Smash itself. When virtually every other character gets introductions of pure adrenaline, ones that sell their characters as badasses and gives them (and in turn their series) absolute respect (look at DK and Diddy's intro, look at Pit's, look at Fox's and Falco's, look at Marth's and Meta Knight's and Ike's)... Falcon's intro is played for laughs. That's all he is, a walking joke. HE'S the joke character in Smash Bros., not Jigglypuff. He's only there because he says funny things and makes people giggle and make stupid Youtube videos. He's not a reflection of his actual series, and he never will be. F-Zero will never be expanded in Smash, since that would potentially damage their "macho, tough-guy" jokester. To hell with that. Since there's no way we're ever getting another F-Zero game anyway, I want to at least let the series die with dignity. Kill Captain Meme, remove F-Zero from Smash, and let me grieve in peace. You do that, and maybe I'll give you $60 for your next game.



That was much longer than I thought it was going to be. You can imagine now why I'm not concerned about the future of Donkey Kong anymore...
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby DK4Ever » September 9th, 2008, 1:56 pm

Oh dear.

I think you're over-reacting just a BIT towards how Falcon is portrayed. Falcon is a character who's loved by everyone just because of how awesome he is.

In Melee, Falcon was an amazing, incredible powerhouse, and he was loved for that.

And the reason he's a "meme generator" is because of a single move, maybe two : Falcon Punch! (and sometimes kick)

Why? Because Sakurai gave him those move in Smash 64? Why did he do that? Because, seriously, as much of an F-Zero fan as you are, come up with a logical moveset for a video-game only Falcon. (As an F-Zero pilot, not a bounty hunter)

It's pretty hard, if not impossible. I love Falcon dude, I love him because he reps a great series, and he's a pretty kick ass guy.

I don't see what the problem is with the way he's portrayed in SSBB. Really.

And yeah, Brawl needs more F-Zero reppin', mostly from Goroh. And assist trophies actually INCREASE their odds of becoming playable mate, since they were important enough to give such a new look to (Goroh, Waluigi, Saki), they were definitely consideredfor characters at some point, and, given the rise in Sin and Punishment awareness, and F-Zero rep-needing (couldnt think of a better way to phrase that :( ) both Goroh and Saki will probably be characters in SSB4.

Trust me.

Edit: And most people I know understand what F-Zero games are really about, and why it's a great series. Why? Because of the Smash games. Not many people were aware of F-Zero (Don't get me started on Mother) in 1999. In comes Falcon, Pwnching his way through the crowd. People are like "Wtf character?" And then they read his description. "Hey, I should try (F-Zero, F-Zero X) "Wow, this is great, I ♥ Falcon, and I also heart his awesome moves., I should show him mine" (Sorry, I HAD to. :) )

Trust me, it worked like this, if not for Smash, F-Zero may have been forgotten forever. One indication, was a review I read made right before Smash 64 was released to the public, that got a 2/10 from the reviewer.... In his review, he said "Well... I guess it's ok, it's got 12 characters, including, Jigglypuff (Wtf?) and Captain Falcon (From Star Fox) "

Yeah, that's what he said. "Captain Falcon : From Star Fox" Yep.

Now, everybody knows who he is, thanks to Smash, so I wouldn't get so angry at Smash just yet mate.
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby Sean » September 9th, 2008, 2:13 pm

Falcon is a character who's loved by everyone just because of how awesome he is.

They love him. They don't love his series, nor are they intrigued to check out his series. And again, he is not a representation of how he actually is in the games.

Why? Because Sakurai gave him those move in Smash 64? Why did he do that? Because, seriously, as much of an F-Zero fan as you are, come up with a logical moveset for a video-game only Falcon. (As an F-Zero pilot, not a bounty hunter)

It's pretty hard, if not impossible. I love Falcon dude, I love him because he reps a great series, and he's a pretty kick ass guy.

He has a GUN. He's had the holster for all three games. It's even modeled in Brawl. LET HIM USE IT. Yes, I understand the need for creativity, which they'd also have to do if they were to bring in another F-Zero character, but it's reached the point where they know it's ridiculous and overblown and revel in it, extending it to his entire character. They even rerecorded his line in Brawl to make the "PAUUNCH" more drawn out and sound like the typical joke misspelling.

And assist trophies actually INCREASE their odds of becoming playable mate, since they were important enough to give such a new look to (Goroh, Waluigi, Saki), they were definitely consideredfor characters at some point, and, given the rise in Sin and Punishment awareness, and F-Zero rep-needing (couldnt think of a better way to phrase that :( ) both Goroh and Saki will probably be characters in SSB4.

That's not what Assist Trophies are about, though. The whole point was to be a place for characters (some wanted, some not) that Sakurai felt couldn't work as playable. They've said this, multiple times in multiple places. I've quoted some of them in the standard Smash thread. Goroh's gone, plain and simple. Like I said, there's no lack of other choices for a second F-Zero rep, so it doesn't have to be him, but the fact that they ruled him out at all is troubling.

And what do you mean, "new look"? Goroh's model is pulled straight from GX, just made all blocky, like it could fit in with the next gen Mario Karts.

Edit: And most people I know understand what F-Zero games are really about, and why it's a great series. Why? Because of the Smash games. Not many people were aware of F-Zero (Don't get me started on Mother) in 1999. In comes Falcon, Pwnching his way through the crowd. People are like "Wtf character?" And then they read his description. "Hey, I should try (F-Zero, F-Zero X) "Wow, this is great, I ♥ Falcon, and I also heart his awesome moves., I should show him mine" (Sorry, I HAD to. :) )

How many of the people you're talking about actually bought an F-Zero game, as a result or otherwise?

Yeah.

Everyone knows who he is. No one knows what he's from, though, or cares. They just care about him, because he makes them laugh.

EDIT: And what is this "If it wasn't for Smash F-Zero would be forgotten and no one knew about it beforehand" malarky? F-Zero X had been out for less than a year before Smash 64 came out. You make it sound like there was nothing before 1999 bar the SNES title.
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby DK4Ever » September 9th, 2008, 3:18 pm

I disagree. I don't think you register just how popular the F-Zero series is. Example, on Smashboards.com, the number one Smash Bros. site, F-Zero has it's own section, which is only granted to one other non-Smash series, Pokemon.

There are tons of F-Zero fans in there, all yearning for a new F-Zero game, still holding statewide GX tournaments, and just loving the series as is.

The original F-Zero also won quite a few awards, just because of how different (not to mention tough) it was.

Here, I'll give you a link to the Pit Stop : http://www.smashboards.com/forumdisplay.php?f=60

Anyway, look around Smash Boards, you'll find lots of people who are fans because of Falcon Punch, but also MAJOR F-Zero fans, who vouch for just about any F-Zero character to be in the Smash games.

Don't count yourself as the only one, and don't think you're alone. There are tons of us F-Zero lovers out there.
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby Sean » September 9th, 2008, 3:24 pm

If the series is so popular then why has every single game since Maximum Velocity (hell, probably since X) bombed? Why did we not get F-Zero Climax outside of Japan? Why did Shigeru Miyamoto himself basically call GX a bad game? We're going on five years since the last game was released anywhere, and six years since the last console installment. Why has there not been a single accountable and justifiable hint about a new F-Zero game in all that time? Just April Fool's pranks and lies.

I'm kinda loath to go too deeply into that part of the discussion since this board is very strict on off-topic discussion, so I'd like to steer it in a direction that still talks about Smash and the next game. F-Zero is done, over, shot in the head in a back alley in its prime and shoved in a dumpster. Smash's treatment of it and its bandying about of Falcon as the joke guy isn't just frustrating, it's disrespectful. (Especially since Mother got the red carpet laid out for it in Brawl... apparently you have to be over as a series to get respect, not just dead and forgotten.)

And don't point out Smashboards to me. They've got people there that rant that every Assist Trophy character is like that because they're obscure. If Goroh is obscure, F-Zero is obscure. In which case why have it in Smash at all. (You know, I guess he's got a point...) Not to mention the reason there's an F-Zero board is because Smashboards made an F-Zero site when GX came out, one I regularly frequented when I got the game. It hasn't updated since 2004. What does that tell you?
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby Gnawzooka » September 9th, 2008, 8:02 pm

:shock: Well, I don't really have anything to say on the matter of Captain Falcon...
HOWEVER!
Some poeple said they wanted Ridley and Petey to be playable. I don't think that would really work. Why? They're bloody huge! Sure, they have some big characters, but Ridley? Seriously, he'd take up too much of the screen. There are some big characters, but they're within reason. Playing as the big bosses would be like playing as Giga Bowser permanently, you'd be able to hit everyone else in one strike, even though they're a bit apart. If they were used, they'd either be simply too large or would have to be shrunken down, and then people would complain about them being smaller than they should be. Oh, or they could zoom out more so that you can't see where you are or what you're doing. Haven't you noticed that such large characters don't usually appear in multiplayer spin-offs (well, it's not exactly a spin-off, but you get the idea) games such as this? For example, I'm a fan of the Crash Bandicoot games, and I certainly didn't mind when the giant polar bears weren't playable in Crash team Racing. Do you see my point?
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby CaptainEddie » September 10th, 2008, 2:38 am

I agree with you there, Gnawzooka. Everybody keeps asking for Ridley and Petey when everybody knows they wouldn't work. And then what happens when everbody is Ridley and Petey? They would have to make some HUGE stages. Besides, Petey is stupid anyway. I don't understand why everybody likes him.
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby The Angry Sun » September 10th, 2008, 3:55 am

Jomingo wrote:and he also even becomes Super Pacman. If I think about it some more I could come up with an entire moveset. His stage would be a retro Pacman stage, like the mario bros./donkey Kong 75m stages. And there would be ghosts running around trying to get people, so you'd have to worry about them as well as the enemy characters.


Super Pac-Man technically isn't canon.

The game wasn't even made by Namco for starters.
It was a rip-off of another game that got turned into a Pac-Man Game.

Now usually the SMB2 rule would come in and that would be fine but since this game wasn't made by Namco like SMB2/DDP was
made by Nintendo. It therefore is not canon.

And thus Super Pac-Man never existed.
At least not his 8-bit incarnation.
As I'm pretty sure he showed somewhere in Pac-Man 2: Adventures in Time.

Also,
Image

I honestly don't see how this would work.
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby Sean » September 10th, 2008, 4:25 am

You know what game Namco also didn't make? Ms. Pac-Man.

And that wouldn't work. This would. Especially considering all the platformers he's been in.

Not that I'm arguing for Pac-Man to get in, if there's ever going to be a third third party I really want it to be Mega Man, but I'm saying that it's not as far-fetched as you think.

...in fact, you're also completely wrong to start with. Super Pac-Man was made by Namco, and was intended to be the real Pac-Man sequel, but they were taking so long that Midway had Ms. Pac-Man made first.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_Pac-Man wrote:It is also the second game to be created by series originator Namco, as Ms. Pac-Man (the second in the series) was originally created without Namco's involvement.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ms._Pac-man wrote:Ms. Pac-Man was originally conceived as a bootlegged hack of Pac-Man called Crazy Otto,[2] created by programmers employed at the General Computer Corporation (GCC).

The programmers, surprised at the quality of the game they had created, showed it to Midway, Namco's American distributor of the original game. Midway had become impatient in waiting for Namco to release their next Pac-Man game (which would be Super Pac-Man), and were enthusiastic that such a game had come to their attention. They bought the rights to Crazy Otto, changed the sprites to fit the Pac-Man "universe," renamed the game Ms. Pac-Man and released it into arcades.


http://www.klov.com/game_detail.php?game_id=8782 wrote:This game, originally called Crazy Otto, was an elaborate enhancement of Pac-Man created by a small company called General Computer Corporation. GCC pitched the title to Bally Midway who bought it and, after some minor changes, changed the game into Ms. Pac-Man. Bally Midway ultimately turned over the rights to Namco in an effort to appease them and not lose the licensing rights to future titles. Namco did ultimately stop licensing games to Bally Midway due to the release of Midway's other "unauthorized" titles such as Pac-Man Plus, Baby Pac-Man, and Jr. Pac-Man.
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby The Angry Sun » September 10th, 2008, 5:06 am

Aw, crud.

I got my sources mixed up.

I was actually referring to the stage not the 8-bit Pac-Man.
Y,know:

His stage would be a retro Pacman stage


If Pac-Man was gonna have a stage I would rather it be Pac-Village i.e the first level of Pac-Man 2.

As for F-Zero.
I don't like F-Zero point blank.

Not because of Captain Falcon or the representation of it in Brawl.
One Major Turn Off was that 30-Second Tease in Masterpieces.
Another is the break-neck speeds it goes.
The fact that I hate Racing Games entirely doesn't help me in liking it.

The ONLY Racing game I ever bought was Crash Team Racing.
And that was because it was made by the series creator, Naughty Dog and it was funner than Mario Kart.(Freaking Blue Shell.)

I don't really think Brawl is supposed to be that type of game that is supposed to represent everything to an exact.

As for Smash 4...

BOWSER'S FREAKING CASTLE!

What the Crud Nintendo?
Bowser is a main freaking character!

And you still don't give us a Bowser's Castle Stage.

Mario Kart gets one every freaking time a game comes out.

Super Circuit got like 3 or 4.(Haven't played it in awhile so don't really know)
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby Sean » September 10th, 2008, 5:31 am

I don't really think Brawl is supposed to be that type of game that is supposed to represent everything to an exact.

As of Brawl, every single series from the original N64 game has at least two characters except for F-Zero and Yoshi. And F-Zero has its most likely second character ruled out in Brawl, along with its only character returned to secret status (and therefore making it the only series from Smash 64 to be secret).

When new voice actors came around since Melee, Brawl rerecorded their lines to keep their characters updated (Peach, the Zelda characters), with some annoying exceptions (argh ZSS). Several characters got redesigned to look like their most recent games (the Zelda characters, the Starfox characters). Peach and Bowser were even redesigned to look more like their standard counterparts.

You don't like F-Zero, fair enough. I don't like Zelda, or Fire Emblem, or Mother, and you don't see me arguing that their presence in Smash should be limited as a result, nor do I try suggesting characters or changes that I honestly don't know a damn thing about.
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Re: Smash Bros. 4: What do you want/expect?

Postby Jomingo » September 10th, 2008, 6:05 am

An 8-bit Pacman stage would work, and I'm not really sure why you would think it wouldn't. Also, I agree that Bowser's Castle should be a stage. Also, on a DKU feature they suggested making "Mr. Virtual Boy", a character created to model the VB games in the same way Game and Watch does. I would definately want that, as I've never really had a chance to play the VB.
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